Extrema Ratio RAOC

EXTREMA RATIO RAO C

THE EXTREMA RATIO RAO C COMES in a rigid cardboard box sporting the 25 year history new Extrema Ratio logo emblem.

Simple presentation boxes are what come from Extrema Ratio but even the box, despite it being simple is well made and tough- and Italian Stylish!. 

Heck, I use my old boxes to transport my stuff in suitcases all over the world! Shame on me!

The Extrema Ratio RAO C comes in 2 variations. All black (but of course!) and this one shown above (Tactical Grey). I liked the sound of "Tactical Grey" and it certainly looks the part, so that's why I got this model.

There are "greys" and "greys"- seriously, there are many shades of grey (memory serves me correctly we can see about 256 scales of grey)!; and the one they have chosen for the hard anodising is very nice. 

Because some greys can look "old fashioned and boring"! Nothing old fashioned or boring here, let me tell you.

The Construction

Well, IMHO the best folders have a fully enclosed back. Why is is good? The more material in contact with the two scales or liners makes for a  more rigid folder and hence stronger. 

It doesn't matter what that material is (G10, carbon etc.) and some manufacturer's use G10 or similar. Extrema Ratio use steel, in this case N690. The liners are made from 420HC.

The aluminium scales are milled from 6082 grade Aluminium and as mentioned hard anodized for extra corrosion and scratch proof durability. (getting a knife scratched has never worried me as I'm not really a collector of knives but a user, however as a collector, one might also be very interested in having their collectors items as resistant to scratching as can be).

The milling pattern looks very funky however, providing very good grip in what is otherwise a straight sided handle. Whilst it may look like the milling goes all the way through the scales, it doesn't.

The closed length of the Extrema Ratio RAO C is 130mm (basically 5") as measured from the arc of the blade to the glass breaker/persuader at the butt end. The maximum closed width is approx 50mm (2"). This IS a pocket friendly EDC folding knife unlike it's bigger brother/cousin/sister etc etc. whatever! (see below).

Seen side by side one soon realises the RAO Expeditions is a ginormous folding knife! Well I guess you can not have some little itty bitty  knife named "Expeditions" can you ?

Here in this above image one can get a glimpse of the width profile and one can easily  see that the widths of the 2 knives are not that dissimilar. THE RAO II Expeditions being about 16mm wide and the RAO C approximately 15mm wide. Unlike the RAO II Expeditions (and the other RAO's), the RAO C sports some 420HC liners and this construction probably accounts for the similar width profile.

Now it's really easy to see the ginormous size of the RAO II (the Expeditions model shown here) as compared to the new Extrema Ratio RAO C.

Now for a quick bit of "Eye Candy"

Not So Obvious (but a really great design improvement and a big PRO IMHO) let's talk about Functionality.

Notice the angled lock release bar? (see image below) It's at an angle instead of the vertical orientation of the locking bar in the RAO models. Well guess what? This makes for a much more ergonomic release of the locking mechanism because your forefinger and thumb will want to naturally pull this part towards you unlike the movement of the lock bar in the RAO II (and other RAO's) whereby the movement in directed upwards, which is not as easy IMHO. By "pulling" the locking bar towards you, you can easily keep your entire hand gripping the RAO C spine/knife body. The RAO II and other RAO models are more likely intended, once open, they are staying open, hence the capability of easily carrying these much larger folders in a sheath like a regular fixed bladed knife via the screw in safety pin.

How Does This Lock Work?

A very nice beefy spring is used as part of the locking mechanism!

As the tang,  rotates into the open position, the rear curved section causes the compression of of the locking bar spring. Continued rotation to the fully open position causes the compressed lock bar to slip into the tang notch. The tang notch of the Extrema Ratio RAO C is set at an angle unlike the near vertical notch as seen in the RAO and RAO II models. Once the notch is presented to the lock bar, the bar will simply move into the notch under the energy of the compressed locking spring. 

The ingenious method the this locking mechanism (and similar to the RAO II and other RAO models) is that any force attributed to the closure of the blade, will be totally resisted by the locking bar.  In the case of the Extrema Ratio RAO C, that locking bar is set within both thick (2.14mm) 420 liners and of course the 6082 Al scales for added strength.

Now a sharp blow to the mechanism, as in a downward thrust of the knife to an immovable object in the RAO II and or other RAO models can cause the compression of the locking bar spring via the momentum of the actual bar causing the compression of the spring as the bar will tend to move in a vertical direction and that vertical direction can only be "up". Under some circumstances, this could cause the lock to be momentarily disengaged (only if it clears the deep notch). 

Hence on those models mentioned above, it is highly recommended to use the supplied locking safety pin in order to totally negate this effect and render the knife essentially as a "fixed blade. 

Now for the RAO C, the same movement the lock bar is not running in a vertical slot but an angled slot and thus will resist a movement in a vertical motion and hence not compress the locking bar spring. To further aid in safety, the Extrema Ratio RAO C sports a built in safety lock and when this is slid forwards, 2 steel plates** ( 2mm of 420 steel) slide above the locking bar, (one on either side of the bar) so any motion which might be felt by the locking bar (if subjected to severed forces) will be prevented from moving and hence the knife will stay locked open and can not close until the safety is disengaged and the locking bar withdrawn.

Conversely, the the RAO C can be locked closed by actuating the safety lock with the blade within the housing.

** Remember there is no direct force upon these plates, they are merely there to negate any effects of severe vibration because the forces are applied to the locking bar itself and the notch of the tang.

Obvious Functionality

Lanyard hole and "persuader" butt end. Nothing more to say about this other than one could possibly use this heavy set end to bust up some glass windows etc. You can also see in this above image that the RAO C can be equipped for either lefthand pock carry or right handed pocket carry (see drilled and tapped scales). The bolts are either TORX or Allen key/hex/socket heads. There is no (fine) adjustment on the main pivot bolt unlike seen in all of the RAO models. The rear Torx is a T8x60, as similar to the  RAO II. All other Torx are smaller. BTW, I'm not going to list the other bolt sizes as pulling apart your new folder would surely negate any warranty offered by ER. 

Excellent spine thumb gimping like as in the "older brother" 兄

The design like in the RAO II and others in this "family" allow for easy maintenance of contact surfaces with lubrication. (I personally use Mountain Bike lubricants (ones designed NOT to attract dirt and mud) or silicone gun lubricants for all of my folding knives).

A very manageable sized knife

 Ok so quick summary (prior to my field review- coming soon!) @BushCampingTools

Pros:

Great size for a "large folder"*** as apposed to a "ginormous folder"

Pocket carry/EDC friendly! (see caveat below).

Can be locked closed.

Very ergonomic lock release to actuate with forefinger and thumb.

Grippy scales, wet or dry.

Deep carry- either right or left handed.

Secure safety lock and easy to actuate.

*** Ok so what's a small folder? Like a 2 bladed SAK.

Cons:

Like ALL folders, (you can't treat with total disdain in regards to mud, dirt and sand), they are NOT maintenance free due to their many moving parts!

The scales in certain areas could have been "smoother" (underside closest to the knife tang) as in the RAO II and RAO II Expeditions, although I can see why ER did not do this as it would not allow them to make both scales and liners flush with one another. It's not a big deal.

The original (as seen in the USA at IWA 2023 pocket clip was in Ti but to be honest, I like this steel design better and Ti doesn't necessarily make for a better clip, nor does it really cut down on carry weight in a significant way. however,.........

the "deep carry" clip could be better designed because even wearing this knife on my "tactical" (and knife carry reinforced) Helikon Tex pants, 

the bolts securing the clip (almost) prevent the pants material to slide all the way to the end of the clip. This would not be a problem if the knife was worn on regular jeans or any pants where the material is NOT reinforced and hence thicker.

The original model as shown at IWA 2023  had a pivot mechanism like the RAO II and was fully adjustable, unlike this current production model of the RAO C. Maybe this was cost cutting? (but not quality cutting). 

It doesn't bother me really, as only more screws and bolts to loose LOL!; and these design changes are to be expected when it comes to the production models.

More EYE CANDY!

Ok so stick around for the real test in my upcoming field review where a lot more will be seen and revealed @BushCampingTools

BCT

Dulotec Diamond Plate Sharpener 1200-600 Grit DIAMOND SHARPENER DULOTEC WITH LEATHER CASE - 600/1200

Ok here's the thing. A "little bird" (as they say) told me that the same company that is making these plates is also making the Lansky ones! Yeah, well this is no surprise, is it?

However, these ones (as shown above and below) can be found on the following website

Sorbe.bg

A Bulgaria company (Dulotec) who's CEO is a designer of outdoor products from flashlights to hunting knives. the only thing I will say is that the pouch is NOT leather but some sort of vinyl. They are trying to get it made out of leather so one can also use it is a strop!

I can't fault it, despite it being about half the thickness again of a similar dimensioned DMT, the weight difference is negligible.

 A note about Dulotec products, I certainly can not fault the stuff I have reviewed. For example, their Solar charging panels are constructed in a more sensible fashion than say some Goal Zero ones, and I have zero doubts that the panels come from exactly the same factory in China as the Goal Zero ones!

Some of his hunting knives are manufactured by Manly in Bulgaria from quality USA alloys along with European quality knife steel alloys, along with his Flashlights being made by companies such as Convoy etc. In regards to the above 1200/600 grit credit card diamond sharpening plate, the test with all of these things is how well have the diamonds been incorporated on the steel. This can only be ascertained by actually using such a device and not possible with the naked eye to determine the integrity of the process, ie sintering, or the homogeneity of the actual size of the diamonds.

So did it work well for the above FKMD knife which actually has a high Rockwell? The answer was YES and did the plate quickly lose it's capacity to abrade the steel? The answer was NO, which is what one wants.

So there you go, a brand whose product does what is says a a very competitive  price point or around $11-00 USD (not including postage).

BCT

Extrema Ratio Caimano Nero N.A. Ranger XXV Anniversarium Limited Edition

 How about this sucker? Get it while it's available.

Extrema Ratio Caimano Nero N.A. Ranger XXV Anniversarium Limited Edition, limited series of only 250 pieces, now available at the best retailers and on www.extremaratio.com

#extremaratio #caimanoneronarangerxxvanniversariumlimitededition #extremaratiocaimanoneronaranger #caimanoneronaranger #ExtremaratioKnivesdivision

This is one cool looking knife.

No automatic version, limited edition, V funky camouflage details.

I'm afraid, I'd have to use it rather than just look at it!

@BushCampingTools

Extrema Ratio RAO C! Available in the best stores and on www.extremaratio.com

 Extrema Ratio RAO C! Available in the best stores and on www.extremaratio.com

#extremaratio #extremaratioraoc #raoc

The Limiting Factor of Small Fixed Bladed Knives and the Possible Way Around Such Issues.

 The Limiting Factor of Small Fixed Bladed Knives and the Possible Way Around Such Issues.

Question: What is the limiting factor with small fixed bladed knives?

Answer: It is the length of the handle. Because if the handle is too small to grip securely then the knife will be of little practical use in reality.

The 3 knives shown directly below are all at the limit for my 8.5 size hand to grip completely*.

By "completely", I mean exactly that, completely. Not partially, not with 2 fingers or 3 fingers, I mean with my complete paw.

Now lets examine the images directly below: The first two knives looking from top to bottom, I can just grip.

Note the end of the handle is only just within my palm.

Again with this above image, the handle only just sits within my palm

Whereas this  knife,  (By Pohl Force)

it is impossible to grip with any significant part of my hand due to the small size of the grip. This knife is marketed as a "finger knife" and whilst in a moment of stupidity I purchased it (I'm selling it) and from a physical shop, so i had ample chance to really feel the product in my hands (yes i  know this was STUPID!). The blade shape and the length of the blade is great, however the handle is way too short to allow one to fully exploit such a good blade design. (Sorry Mr Pohl Force, this was a BS design).

Ok maybe I'm too tough here, as it was marketed as a "finger knife" However, I would say "finger knives" are somewhat of a gimmick. The only exception I would make here is that the blade thickness of such knives is usually far thicker than an equivalently sized folding knife and hence there is some support for a "strength" advantage over a similar sized folding knife. BUT (yes everything before a BUT is BS) unlike the "Finger knife", the folding knife will have a decent sized handle to grip!

Here it is easy to see the differences in handle lengths. The funny thing is that the Pohl Force knife will have the greatest "levering effect" upon the small handle, this can be disadvantageous to the the user under certain circumstances.

In the above image you can easily see these differences I'm talking about.

Here is another example of the smallest I would go to. The ER Satre has a slightly longer grip than my 

Small Knives with a Good Grip

Now the following knives all have decent comfortable grips. Probably, the Kizlyar Supreme (middle knife AUS8) and the WTG mini Nomad EDC (In ATS-34 Limited Edition) are the most comfortable and also lighter than the WTG Mt Laguna (Wingman 115 Design) because it is using rather thick (it's still ok but maybe overkill) K110 6.25mm steel, ie 1/4" sheet and the other 2 knives are using 3mm (Kizlyar Supreme URBAN) and 4mm (WTG Nomad EDC). None the less they all have good handles and this is the limiting factor for decreasing size of a fixed blade knife for practical usage in MHO.

The above knives are not really hunting knives although like all things one could if they had to. The Mt laguna is too thick for this purpose and whilst the blade shape is not too bad to skin with, the handle is too wide IMHO, it's more of a lightweight but very sturdy camp/hiking knife for well walked to semi-wild tracks/camping. The Kizlyar Supreme Urban, good for fishing (it has a good point) -but not for filleting of course), hunting (narrower handle and tapering for a good comfortable grip during working with carcasses; the WTG EDC Nomad, excellent handle; excels at carving/woodworking and generalist duties; could also be used for hunting although I would have made the major arc of the belly closer to the tip for this purpose (Ok it's not meant to be a hunting knife).

Fox knives excellent FX-143MB (Niolox steel)

So how can you carry a small knife with a decent sized handle and also a decent sized blade. Firstly, for small knives, I would recommend one ONLY purchase them after trying them to see if they really fit your hand properly. Then check the carry system on how useful is it really because if the handle is really small then how will it be trying to extract it from the scabbard? I'm not talking some sort of tactical split second extraction, I'm talking about a normal extraction for camping, hunting/hiking, fishing etc.

Maybe you prefer a large folding locking knife In this case the Extrema Ratio RAOII - Expeditions version); this will give you the blade length, along with a sturdier blade (compared to a regular locking folding knife of similar (open) length).

You will get a bigger handle length and maybe (dependent upon the brand make and model) give you some lateral stability too (within reason) for a folding knife- BUT remember knives are for cutting NOT prying, regardless of what the marketing says.

The above image shows (from left to right) a large folding and locking knife closed (ER HF1T- no longer made), a medium sized fixed blade (RaidOps Black Tiger II) and knives you have already seen (if you have read this far), exception being the Extrema Ratio T4000S, which I include as another excellent small fixed blade).

How big is that ER RAOII when folded?

Similar sized blades of medium sized knives however one is folding knife (Extrema Ratio HF2D Drop point).

The following 3 images are all what I consider very sturdy folding knives,  (FKMD FX-446S ODS N690), Nieto Centauro XXL 440C),  Extrema Ratio HF1T N690), all with different locking mechanisms.

So there you have it, try before you buy is my advice if you want to go small because the handle may not fit you hand properly and if it doesn't then maybe the knife, no matter how cool the blade design is or how much you simply like the blade, it will never give you the performance because of the wrong grip.

Note all of the knives you see here have been extensively reviewed on @BushCampingTools and also here on this blog over the years. Any questions just drop me a mail or write in the comments here!

Thanks for reading!

BCT